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Speaker 1

00:00

My name is Ben Ha and I'm the founder and former CEO of the Cheeseburger Network and also co-founder of the news app Circa. And now I work at Y Combinator on some special projects. So I first started going to therapy about 4 or 5 years ago when I was going through a lot of stress at work. And it was actually prompted by 1 of my board members, Brad Feld, who really believes in making sure that your mind is in a great place and so it allows you to be highly performant.

Speaker 1

00:30

And so he suggested that I go see Jerry Colonna, who is a well-known CEO coach out of New York. And so when I was in New York I would see him and that's how my entrepreneurial side of therapy started. So I think there's a lot of myths about what therapy is, and a lot of people wait until there's a crisis. And what that's like doing is like, it's finding a cure when the disease is like much harder to cure, right?

Speaker 1

00:59

And so it takes a lot more effort. If you were a runner and you felt like there was something wrong with your ankle when you're running, would you wait until it was flaming and terrible until you went to see a doctor? You wouldn't. And for whatever reason, we feel like there's a stigma to therapy.

Speaker 1

01:13

And so people wait until it's gotten really bad, until they can't handle it anymore. And I think that actually causes bigger problems down the road. And I also don't think therapy is about recovery from something negative. I think it can be used to actually keep yourself in a really optimal state, which I think entrepreneurial therapy and CEO coaching should really be about.

Speaker 1

01:33

So 1 of the things that I'm doing right now through KIPP is that I'm actually seeing a personal therapist, which is actually a first thing, first time use of therapy for me. I've always used it as CEO coaching, which is a slightly different framework. And so in CEO coaching, I'm trying to figure out what is preventing me from making the difficult decisions, what is preventing me from seeing the perspective that I need to see to keep the company moving forward. And so those techniques are about understanding my relationships with my employees and my executives, understanding the stresses in my life.

Speaker 1

02:04

But on the personal side, I'm using it right now to understand my responses and my emotional reactions to certain topics. So I'm trying to examine what behaviors are indicative of me running away from a problem, running away from something that's uncomfortable and things like that. And another is like behaviors that drive me towards doing something constructive. Like I wanna read, I want to actually write something.

Speaker 1

02:30

And what triggers that behavior and how do I keep supporting that? 1 of the mantras that I hear from Jerry and my former CEO coach Khalid Halim was this – this being so, so what? And it's like Jerry says this so often that I feel like I should get it tattooed like somewhere on him. And the mentality here is, what is the reality of the situation?

Speaker 1

02:56

And what are you going to do about it? And if you put it in those terms, it feels like, you know, something that we've always heard before. But what he's saying is, this is a situation that you have to deal with. There's nothing else you can do to change that situation.

Speaker 1

03:08

So what are you going to do? And it's actually removed some of the pain and the stress and emotion or the euphoria out of the situation that you're in, and it makes you focus on it from a very calm and deferential level, which makes you go, okay, this is our situation. What are the options available? I am not going to react emotionally to this.

Speaker 1

03:31

I'm going to understand my emotion and see how to actually use it in a better way. So I think if you're using therapy to manage depression, I think there's a there's a assumption of honesty that I think people need to make about their current state. Because if you're in denial and your therapist doesn't know it, like they can't help you. If you try to hide it, they might be able to figure out if there's something wrong, maybe you're hiding something, but you're actually not investing the right amount of honesty and effort into the process.

Speaker 1

04:01

So it's like going to your coding team and saying, I want this feature built or I want to make sure that there's a higher performance on this part of our service, but that's not really what you want. Now, how would you tell them that? So a therapist here is like an employee or a service provider, so that you want to maximize their time and your time. And if you're not willing to make that commitment, I think it's very difficult to get what you need out of it.

Speaker 1

04:30

I think some great therapists are able to actually tease out something that you may not be aware of, and I think that's part of the process. So if you're using it to manage depression, I think you need to be clear that you have depression. If you have it, say it. If you're just sad, say it.

Speaker 1

04:48

There's no stigma with this, like this is private, so go have those moments of honest conversation so they can help you. On the performance side of things, I think it's actually very helpful to know what your personal motivations are, even if it's in the context of work. Right, you're running a startup, and if your desire is, I just want to make a shit ton of money, fine, that's your desire, let's be honest about that. If that's not what you want to do, and money makes you uncomfortable, that's actually something to talk about as well.

Speaker 1

05:19

A lot of entrepreneurs I know hesitate about spending money on therapy or CEO coaching and things like that because they feel like it's a personal expense. And my response to them is that If you are a better person mentally and emotionally, because you're able to actually spend that time being coached on it, I think a couple hundred bucks a week, every 2 weeks, or a month is nothing compared to the amount of effort that you can save and the amount of ROI you're gonna get from that. So I think it's, as a investor and as a board member, I recommend that people spend that money and actually spend time with a therapist or a CEO coach because I know the ROI is great. You